View Full Version : the disruptor need rework ?
On TS, i tried the dissy on my spy. It's pretty useless when you see what a FirstLove can do ! ... what do you think ? Who has tried it ?
It's TL115. This weapon should be massively dangerous :)
its dangerous... but u have to aim very good.
the same with slasher. theres a problem with burst weapons i think
u need a better aiming with high frequency weapons than with low freq weapons.
xbow -> slasher e.g.
its dangerous... but u have to aim very good.
the same with slasher. theres a problem with burst weapons i think
u need a better aiming with high frequency weapons than with low freq weapons.
xbow -> slasher e.g.
But the point is Why use a Disrupter when you can use its lower TL Brother and have easier aiming and more damage output. I agree fully on giving the dissy and other pulse-like weapons a boost.
Jason Parker
01-03-07, 16:06
yup give them a boost ;-) but don't whine afterwards if you get pwnd by someone using them.
ok that sounded a bit drastical.
Just wanted to agree with nabbl, it's dangerous to do DMG increases on high frequented weapons.
A poison DoT modded ceres Riflke shows what this can lead to:
A totaly imbalanced and overpowered weapon.
Dissy is a burst weapon and actually on TS it's doing constant rate firing.
* = fire -=nothing happen
retail server:
*-*-*----*-*-*----*-*-*
=> time =>
on TS it's
*--*--*--*--*--*--*--*
=> time =>
If the dissy is going to be "burst" (like in retail) with high damage and needs good aim skill to be effective, then I don't understand why it would do constant firing ?
That should be coherent. If it's mentioned "burst" in the weapon info screen, it should fire with bursts.
Same happen with the first love.
just tested it again on the new patch 166.
Who's going to use this weapon ?
If i'm in front of someone, lock it, left click to fire one burst and running away, the four bullet """burst""" is so long that i can run away while it still firing, still locked on the runner who takes damage.
Do i have to open a bug report for that ?
i noticed it speaks about burst and aim in the "APU class" balance topic.
I answered this : http://forum.neocron.com/showpost.php?p=2059346&postcount=27
Which is directly tied to the current topic.
Lifewaster
07-03-07, 14:21
If i'm in front of someone, lock it, left click to fire one burst and running away, the four bullet """burst""" is so long that i can run away while it still firing, still locked on the runner who takes damage.
So actually....its like a single shot weapon....with a DOT ?
1 shot -> 1 hit -> followed by 3 more automatic hits (DOT)
^^
But this makes it sound good , why it is so poor then? too low dmg ?
it's poor because bugged and doesn't work a coherent way :)
then, too low frequency for the damage you get in return
second, a burst like follow for this kind of weapon:
*-*-*-*---*-*-*-*
(old style 2.1 burst)
is more adapted than the 2.2 TS current:
*---*---*---*---*---*
-EDIT- what i mean is : we know that aim accuracy is valid for a whole burst period : it's not been really noticed with the 2.1 burst one because 4-shots freq was high... In the second burst mode, what's the interest to stay with that old "4-non-stop-shots" ? => move it single fire or make it back like 2.1 burst mode ...
Ok now I see what you mean by "burst"
Dissruptor is shit, because its frequency is low. It's the same dilemma over and over, and is why people are choosing to go for faster weapons like the FL.
Lets say "burst" is what we had in 2.1 (FL, dissy and the like), while 2.2 FL is "automatic" and 2.2 dissy is "shit" :p
And yes having so low frequency on a dissie, is ridiculous and create silly effects
DOWN WITH BURST WEAPONS-----LONG LIVE THE AUTOMATICS :P
Ok now I see what you mean by "burst"
Dissruptor is shit, because its frequency is low. It's the same dilemma over and over, and is why people are choosing to go for faster weapons like the FL.
Lets say "burst" is what we had in 2.1 (FL, dissy and the like), while 2.2 FL is "automatic" and 2.2 dissy is "shit" :p
And yes having so low frequency on a dissie, is ridiculous and create silly effects
DOWN WITH BURST WEAPONS-----LONG LIVE THE AUTOMATICS :P
That the dissy has low freq is one thing i can leave with, where it's bad is when you miss your aim, and have to wait each 4 shots before be able to shoot again. In PvP that's very long, four dissy 2.2 shots. It could be good if one-clic = one-shot , long-hold-down-clic = automatic burst.
clic-release = just stop !
The fact that for *any* clic your gone for 4 longs shots is silly and make the weapon almost useless ...
That the dissy has low freq is one thing i can leave with, where it's bad is when you miss your aim, and have to wait each 4 shots before be able to shoot again. In PvP that's very long, four dissy 2.2 shots. It could be good if one-clic = one-shot , long-hold-down-clic = automatic burst.
clic-release = just stop !
The fact that for *any* clic your gone for 4 longs shots is silly and make the weapon almost useless ...
Dump stupid dissy in the garbage bin, and take a nice brand new shiny FL. Thats what you really need :)
In any case though, I just love those **-- graphics :angel:
hehe :)
FL in 2.2 currently does:
*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*
Dissy could do:
**--**--**--**-**
or
***---***---***---***
Just invent !
All is to calculate damage per second , or damage per burst period to make it balanced....
that would be awesone ! :)
I really believe in differents orginals burst modes for weapons, to make more fun!
But you're right.... the FL in 2.2 is the weapon i prefer...
Apocalypsox
08-03-07, 00:44
Dissy needs to shoot fast tbh. Slasher does.
slasher is just as slow as dissy if not slower on ts apoc :/
both r crap, and its very upsetting
Apocalypsox
08-03-07, 02:40
well then they need to be faster. us rifle users especially already have enough slow weapons. Id like to be able to make a wall of lasers or plasma On occasion if i feel like it. :mad:
I am almost certain that you are mistaken about the FL/dissie/slasher issue Nabbl. I will perform some tests later on, and I hope we both meet and test. The test is pretty simple: you begin shooting blobs at first not in runner but a little on the right or left, simulating that you lose aim. Use the dissie for this, as it shoots bursts of 3 blobs. Then, as you have missed the 1st blob, home the weapon on target and see if it hits at all. If what you say is right, then you do 0 dmg. If what I say is correct, you do some dmg. You cant do this using the FL , as its very fast, but dissie is ok.
I also remind you, that strain CS/FL blobs, can still damage innocent bystanders. It has happened many many times in NF, and that these weapons are the only ones that hit stealthers. So maybe this is factor to consider as well
I am almost certain that you are mistaken about the FL/dissie/slasher issue Nabbl. I will perform some tests later on, and I hope we both meet and test. The test is pretty simple: you begin shooting blobs at first not in runner but a little on the right or left, simulating that you lose aim. Use the dissie for this, as it shoots bursts of 3 blobs. Then, as you have missed the 1st blob, home the weapon on target and see if it hits at all. If what you say is right, then you do 0 dmg. If what I say is correct, you do some dmg. You cant do this using the FL , as its very fast, but dissie is ok.
I'm pretty sure it would be zero.
You can test the other way around, like i described before in this thread : aim the target and shoot the first blob then voluntarily loose aim for the next two blob that follow. See how damage you get.
I can't certify for damages, but what i can say is if you aim anything else while the burst run, you'll see blob still going to the original's locked target.
I am almost certain that you are mistaken about the FL/dissie/slasher issue Nabbl. I will perform some tests later on, and I hope we both meet and test. The test is pretty simple: you begin shooting blobs at first not in runner but a little on the right or left, simulating that you lose aim. Use the dissie for this, as it shoots bursts of 3 blobs. Then, as you have missed the 1st blob, home the weapon on target and see if it hits at all. If what you say is right, then you do 0 dmg. If what I say is correct, you do some dmg. You cant do this using the FL , as its very fast, but dissie is ok.
I also remind you, that strain CS/FL blobs, can still damage innocent bystanders. It has happened many many times in NF, and that these weapons are the only ones that hit stealthers. So maybe this is factor to consider as well
i tested it on guards with slasher. the dmg was = 0.
and the area damage factor of cs and fl isnt very strong. i hit stealthers very often with my cs and i did like 10-15 dmg with one mag on retail.
Jason Parker
08-03-07, 13:10
I'm pretty sure it would be zero.
You can test the other way around, like i described before in this thread : aim the target and shoot the first blob then voluntarily loose aim for the next two blob that follow. See how damage you get.
I can't certify for damages, but what i can say is if you aim anything else while the burst run, you'll see blob still going to the original's locked target.
right. Other than I understood from what Carnage and John Doe were saying, there is no targeting calculation made for each single shot of a burst. If you hit or not is decided the Moment you pull the trigger. If you are on target the moment you press LMB you will hit the whole burst even if the target runs around a corner. Vise versa you miss the whole burst if you are not on target the Moment you press LMB.
Apart from all discussion if DMG or Frequency is more important I see that in it self as a huge problem, it just shouldn't work that way. Targeting should be done for each single shot wether it's a burst weapon or not.
And if I understood right what John Doe said in the diskussions before the testserver started, that is what he was wanting to do. So either I got totaly wrong what was said from Dev side or something went wrong in implementation and this is a bug.
Jason Parker
08-03-07, 13:22
Ok tested it again, I was wrong about the running around corners thing.
You shot's go to the right direction (so still target lock) but hit the wall correctly.
So obviously the Line of Sight Test is done for each shot for its own, but targeting is done just at the start of a burst.
I'd say this is a bug.
ok. so, can we have a dev post on this issue, please ? Just to fix what we observed.
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